The community known as “national religious” (dati leumi) has been undergoing many changes over the past 30 or so years. This community, largely congruent with the religious Zionist movement, prides itself for having a “mixed community.” This means that men and women are not completely shielded from one another. However, over the years, a disconnect has been forming between the leadership and the members of the community. It has become more en vogue to be “more religious.” Bnei Akiva used to be an a priori desegregated youth group. Now, it is more prestigious in many places for a Bnei Akiva branch to be segregated. Group activities in such places are conducted for boys and girls separately. These communities usually also have segregated schools, as well, and not for pedagogical reasons.
In recent years, this trend has manifested itself in yet another way – the surge of Torani schools. This labeling carries with it yet more coercion. When such a school surfaces (usually by way of converting a Mamlachti Dati school), boys and girls are forceably segregated, and a community who had thought of itself as a dati leumi, wakes up and sees it has become hardal. Members of the community are afraid to speak up, for fear of public censure, for being seen as not religious enough.
Efrat Shapira-Rosenberg has written about such an experience, of waking up and finding she is suddenly “not religious enough.” (Hebrew) “The prevalent position in the dati community today is that torani people are the serious ones… Someone needs to get up, stop the flow, stop the inferiority feelings and the apologetics, and to stand proudly for what we are, and in what we believe.”
Much has been made in recent years of the fact that members of this community have taken up so many key leadership positions in the army, that so many serve in elite units, and so many volunteer and go to officers’ school. This community, however, is eating itself from the inside out. A move towards stringency is not always a good thing, andif you are strong in your beliefs, moving to the right does not make you stronger in those same beliefs.
People who do believe that being torani is good have every right to hold these beliefs. However, much more is happening here. New communities are not being founded on the basis of this ideology. Established communities are being told they are not truly religious, and being forced to change, against the will of most. The consequences of this coercion are manifold. At the very least, when the children in these places will see one thing at home, and learn another in school, many more will choose to just leave everything behind.
The religious Zionist community is an important part of Israel. However, sometimes the self-proclaimed leaders, “the Rabbis”, don’t always know best. Very often, in fact. As the Rabbi of my community once said, if we all listened to the Rabbis, there would be no State of Israel today. So if “the Rabbis” do not stand down, there will soon be a lot of people who are without a community, and the happily torani community will bear more than a passing resemblence to simply haredim who do serve in the army.
You make many accusations with very little fact to prove your theses. Also, why do you believe it is proper and appropriate to ignore the laws of lashon ha-ra and denigrate entire communities? You make accusations of coercion when in many cases it is the parents and families who wish to introduce a different approach than was before. Aren’t they entitled to make their own choices? This is how things have been in many, many communities throughout the history of ‘civilized’ mankind. The bottom line is that you are saying that democratic principles should be put into place only when you agree with the outcome, otherwise democracy has no place. Make up your mind, democracy isn’t there to pick and choose when you want it.
Feel free to delete this comment if you wish.
B”H
I wish such “trends” were as prevalent as you seem to claim.
First off this movement in this direction is nothing new. B”H the number of women who cover their has increased. That’s the halacha. B”H more and more Jews realize that we live according to halacha and not how we “feel” or how the goyim necessarily do things.
Taking over? One of the reasons schools in Yo”Sh {for example} have begun as mixed schools in the first place is due to lack of students, and other pragmatic reasons, completely bedi’avad.
No rabbi in his right mind will tell you with halachic sources that it is permissible leChathillah to mix boys and girls after the sixth grade.
The ones who do have no halachic leg to stand on.
Qal weHomer, youth groups, which are essentially social in nature.
This is the halacha, not just some humrah.
Perhaps you’ll be happy to know that the BA conventions are still mixed. I can personally vouche for the disgusting behavior exhibited at such conventions from when I lived in Ofra, next to the guest houses.
The real difference between Datti and Torani communities is that the Torani communities recognize that there are more than just one mitzvah {of settling the land}, and that Jews must do their best to follow it.
The differences are only becoming more and more prevalent now, due to issues of how one is supposed to live when halacha is in opposition to Israeli Law {soldiers refusing anti Torah orders or not}, conventional Western philosophies and sensibilities, or both.
The mamlachtim are the hypocritical ones who confuse halacha with Israeli law, which are diametrically opposed, more and more.
At least the leftist like in Meretz are consistent.
LMB – My point was that this is not what many of the community members want. Self-appointed community leaders make many of these decisions, and other families are simply along for the ride. Later on, their kids who don’t agree with the direction any longer, will end up on the other side of the fence entirely. If it’s democratically, then fine – but I really don’t believe it is.
BY – My point is about communities, not Halacha, so I don’t want to get into a halachic argument. However, there are Rabbis who say that mixed BA is ok lechatchila – (halachically, why is socializing forbidden? I’m not talking about anything other learning/discussing things together).
I think you’re way off mark but claiming that “dati” communities only recognize yishuv ha’aretz as the only mitzvah. If things go too far, and in your words there is “disgusting behavior” then the education is lacking (no news here). (And gender issues in halacha are not the only “missing” mitzvot, either) That doesn’t mean the ideals are wrong – it means the community is not doing a good job of teaching, of educating the next generation. In any case, there is a growing split within the larger religious Zionist commnunity, and no leadership has done a good job of addressing this at all.
I think it would be more accurate to say that [most] mamlachtim not “datti” communities have this one mitzvah mentality. So, I stand corrected.
Your right about education and leadership.
You said you didn’t want to get into halacha, so we won’t.
However, I will point out that there are always exceptions to the rule. This concept IS within halacha. For example, the youth you mention who are at risk at ending up on the other side. Individuals require an individual approach. Sometimes that’s being stringent; sometimes that’s being chilled out {expression used here purposefully}. No arguments there.
As far as democracy and what the community wants, I couldn’t disagree with you more.
BY – “As far as democracy and what the community wants, I couldn’t disagree with you more.” Understood. However, I will continue to disagree, but if I understand correctly that is because of our different stances/approaches/etc regarding Halacha.
I can’t say. We have only just really met, and we have never begun to discuss it until now.
In the future, we can {I suggest privately for now} if you like.
In the meantime, I guess I’ll have to take your word for it.